# Reading > Who Said That? >  A mystery wrapped in an enigma

## Munro

Who once described something as a "mystery wrapped in an enigma"?
I think it's Winston Churchill, and is he referring to the mysterious life of Jane Austen or the history of Russia as a country? I think the former and my father argues the latter. Can someone enlighten us by any chance?

----------


## stavrokin

mystery wrapped in an enigma?

is that a riddle impossible to be solved?

:o

----------


## Blackadder

A mystery wrapped in an enigma is an English expression that usually means that there are layers of mysteries or secrecy obscuring a central problem that need to be worked out until you get to the core of the thing.

I have no idea where it originated, but it wouldn't surprise me if Churchill coined it. He was quite the wordsmith.

----------


## Munro

Thanks Blackadder, I'd definitely agree it was Churchill, but I can't find if he was talking about Russia or Jane Austen (two completely unrelated topics in themselves!). It's actually irritating me now, lol, I watched two documentaries recently, one on each subject, which is where I heard the quote. But I got confused cos you know how narrator voices on these documentaries all sound the same? So the audio playback is obsolete...maybe one day...

----------


## AbdoRinbo

"Perhaps there's more to Newman than meets the eye." 

"No, there's less." 

"Maybe he's an enigma, a mystery wrapped in a riddle." 

"He's a mystery wrapped in a Twinkie." 

-- Elaine and Jerry, 'Seinfeld'.

----------


## den

Abdo's obsession with `Seinfeld' proves to us there's contemporary use of this `quote' or theorem...  :Rolleyes:   :Biggrin: 

I've seen it expressed in everything from political terms to eastern philosophical terms. One thing I love about it, it's open to subjective interpretation, much like the arabic quote I have in my sigline. It's a very personal statement for me.  :Wink:

----------


## AbdoRinbo

Geez, den, I feel like I know you already.

----------


## electric_kool_aid

I'm going with Elaine and Jerry on that one. Larry David is a genius!

----------


## AbdoRinbo

Did you know that he was the voice of Mr. Steinbrenner, George's boss? Heh, it's funny how most people assume he is this tortured recluse who sits in a dark corner crafting intricately pieced comic plots, when in reality he is a fairly good-humored fellow. What I wouldn't give to have his ability to think up story-lines; I'd just sit and write all day, never get bored.

----------


## electric_kool_aid

I totally agree. I love his show Curb Your Enthusiam as well. He reminds me of George actually.

----------


## Munro

I've watched about 50 episodes of _Seinfeld_ and I can't remember what any of them were about...I just remember stuff...and situations...and Kramer...

Abdo, were you joking about Larry David's ability to think up storylines, or were you serious? You know, cos it's the show about nothing and all... It would be so fun to write though, I agree.

----------


## AbdoRinbo

I was dead serious. There isn't a single episode of 'Seinfeld' that didn't make me laugh out loud. 

Jeez, I wish they'd put out the DVDs already.

----------


## Alvis

Yeah, it was winstone churchil talking about Russia. It was during a WW2 speech where he was calling to help Russia during the german siege on Moscow :o

----------


## Munro

THANK YOU! Hooray, now I know. 
Even though you've proved me wrong against my dad, and I look a fool because I was so stubborn and proud in my guess, thank you.

----------


## AbdoRinbo

Finally! I just heard they're gonna put the 'Seinfeld' DVDs out sometime next year. 

_Heigho! Heigho!
Heigho! Heigho!
Heigho! Heigho!_

----------


## rlsuth

> Who once described something as a "mystery wrapped in an enigma"?
> I think it's Winston Churchill, and is he referring to the mysterious life of Jane Austen or the history of Russia as a country? I think the former and my father argues the latter. Can someone enlighten us by any chance?



"a riddle wrapped in mystery inside an enigma" :

It was Winston Churchill on the 1st October 1939 in a speech about Russia.

For the actual speech that he read from, see here: http://www.chu.cam.ac.uk/archives/gallery/russia/CHAR_09_138_46.shtml

----------


## boonewtune

> Who once described something as a "mystery wrapped in an enigma"?
> I think it's Winston Churchill, and is he referring to the mysterious life of Jane Austen or the history of Russia as a country? I think the former and my father argues the latter. Can someone enlighten us by any chance?


Actually the whole quote goes like this: _I cannot forecast to you the action of Russia. It is a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma._ Radio broadcast, (Oct. 1, 1939)

----------


## starrwriter

Who said a mystery wrapped in an enema?

Probably the same guy who said this town needs an enema.

Never mind.

----------


## starrwriter

Funny how this thread was stopped dead in its tracks by a little scatological humor.

----------


## chmpman

Well, if you look at the years of the posts, it was dead a long time ago. But may be back again in a few years.

----------


## antiquary

I was going to give the final answer, but now I see Boonewtune has already given it. I must read every post next time.

----------


## anarchae

A form of Winston Churchill's quotation, made in a radio broadcast in October 1939: 

"I cannot forecast to you the action of Russia. It is a riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma; but perhaps there is a key. That key is Russian national interest."

----------


## Granny5

From Google:

Meaning

A puzzle - difficult to solve.

Origin

A form of Winston Churchill's quotation, made in a radio broadcast in October 1939: 

"I cannot forecast to you the action of Russia. It is a riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma; but perhaps there is a key. That key is Russian national interest

----------


## Ozymandias

"A riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma" was Churchill referring to the Soviet Union.

He was also attributed with having said about ending sentences in prepositions: "This is the sort of bloody nonsense up with which I will not put."

:-)

----------


## AuntShecky

> "A riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma" was Churchill referring to the Soviet Union.
> 
> He was also attributed with having said about ending sentences in prepositions: "This is the sort of bloody nonsense up with which I will not put."
> 
> :-)


Actually it was "This is the kind of _pedantry_ up with which I will not put."

----------


## ballb

Churchill was reproached for his support for Stalin & the Soviet Union. He was reminded of his pre-war speech about the "bestial appetites of Leninism" Churchill reposnded... "If Hitler marched into Hell I would find something good to say about the Devil"

----------

