# Reading > Philosophical Literature >  God and all

## G L Wilson

God and all about him is a lie. If He exists, the world doesn't; and if the world doesn't exist, then He doesn't. He is quite impossible. This is a theory at any rate. I care little for myself, it's others that worry me.

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## mazHur

God is the beginning
God is the End.
You can hear him
In the chirp of sparrows;
You can hear him talk
In the silence of the desert;
You can find Him everywhere
Only IF you knew
Only IF your could hear
Only IF you could see
Only IF you could realize
Only IF you believed
That there is something more
Than YOU knew
That there is something less
That you've understood!!

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## G L Wilson

> God is the beginning
> God is the End.
> You can hear him
> In the chirp of sparrows;
> You can hear him talk
> In the silence of the desert;
> You can find Him everywhere
> Only IF you knew
> Only IF your could hear
> ...


Beautiful.

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## mazHur

> Beautiful.


Thank you...

_All praise be to Him
Who holds the reins
Of time and space
Who has His own ways
Of doing things
Who gives life
And causes Death
Who from barren lands
Sparks up life
Who from green lands
Turns roses into dust
Who that holds the heavens
And All below
Who that is Amazing
Mysterious and full of Suspense
He who is Magnificent and the Greatest
Who is Kind and Merciful
But Avenger at the same time!
What do you call Him??
God, Krishna, Ram or Allah??
Whoever He may be
By Whatever name you called Him
He is a Rose with Thorns
He is All Evident yet Hidden
Who is Imperceivable
Who is the Master of Destiny
Creator and Destroyer
Malign Him not._
mazHur

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## G L Wilson

> Thank you...
> 
> _All praise be to Him
> Who holds the reins
> Of time and space
> Who has His own ways
> Of doing things
> Who gives life
> And causes Death
> ...


And Mohammed was a man, a mere man.

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## mazHur

> And Mohammed was a man, a mere man.


*
Yes, Muhammad was a Man
A Mere Man
A Man among Men
A Man
A Man who still lives on
In the hearts of billions
More than any other of the Greatest Men
Who immensely influenced this World
Who impressed hearts in millions 
or billions.
To be a Man, a mere Man 
Is better than to be a fickle god
Of Mythology or of Men
A Man who conquered 
a great many Human Hearts
Who was like Us
Whom a great Men won't stop praising
Who remains the apple of a great many people
Whom whose people(and others too) 
Consider a Man, a mere Man
Surely he cannot be God
To be Human and live like a Human
And live on in the hearts of billions
Isn't a joke
Find me a Man like him
And I will be his servant!!*  :Smile: 
mazHur

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## G L Wilson

Man can never be God, it is too dangerous.

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## Dialectic

This is quite the discussion.  :Willy Nilly: 

I will say this though, as an atheist, I grow immensely tired of the borderline militant approach which with many of those who share the same outlook as I approach matters of religion and faith. 

Like philosophy, religious faith represents an attempt on the part of the individual to come to grips with a reality that is apparently disorderly and meaningless. While I may not ascribe to any religious faith myself, it nonetheless plays an important and essential role in the life of the individual and of that of the community. It provides people with feelings of connection and civic obligation and it encourages them to place value in things outside of their material existence. Certainly it can be problematic when taken as dogma, but so can nationalism and marxism; as shown in the rise of fascism and stalinism. 

Toleration is a virtue in and of itself, and people would gain immensely from realizing that.

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## G L Wilson

> This is quite the discussion. 
> 
> I will say this though, as an atheist, I grow immensely tired of the borderline militant approach which with many of those who share the same outlook as I approach matters of religion and faith. 
> 
> Like philosophy, religious faith represents an attempt on the part of the individual to come to grips with a reality that is apparently disorderly and meaningless. While I may not ascribe to any religious faith myself, it nonetheless plays an important and essential role in the life of the individual and of that of the community. It provides people with feelings of connection and civic obligation and it encourages them to place value in things outside of their material existence. Certainly it can be problematic when taken as dogma, but so can nationalism and marxism; as shown in the rise of fascism and stalinism. 
> 
> Toleration is a virtue in and of itself, and people would gain immensely from realizing that.


Richard Dawkins is civil virtue in fancy dress, no-one ever said that I was decent.

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## mazHur

> Man can never be God, it is too dangerous.


God I will hate to Be
He is too self-centred and easy-going;
Angel I will abhor to Be
Angels have no heart of their own!
I am a Man and so I shall Be
Better be a Human than anything else!
regards
mazHur

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## G L Wilson

> God I will hate to Be
> He is too self-centred and easy-going;
> Angel I will abhor to Be
> Angels have no heart of their own!
> I am a Man and so I shall Be
> Better be a Human than anything else!
> regards
> mazHur


Too right, mate.

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## Atehequa

Without earth there can be no heaven

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## Paulclem

> This is quite the discussion. 
> 
> I will say this though, as an atheist, I grow immensely tired of the borderline militant approach which with many of those who share the same outlook as I approach matters of religion and faith. 
> 
> Like philosophy, religious faith represents an attempt on the part of the individual to come to grips with a reality that is apparently disorderly and meaningless. While I may not ascribe to any religious faith myself, it nonetheless plays an important and essential role in the life of the individual and of that of the community. It provides people with feelings of connection and civic obligation and it encourages them to place value in things outside of their material existence. Certainly it can be problematic when taken as dogma, but so can nationalism and marxism; as shown in the rise of fascism and stalinism. 
> 
> Toleration is a virtue in and of itself, and people would gain immensely from realizing that.


I think your post is shows a very fair and balanced view. The point is not perhaps whether God - (creator ultimate God) - exists in the end, but how we as humans with our differing weightings upon science, religion and personal experience deal with our fellow man as a believer or as an unbeliever. 

It's been debated on this forum a lot, and sometimes devolves into mere argument and abuse. yet the question remains.

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## G L Wilson

> Without earth there can be no heaven


To play the Devil's advocate for a moment: Without hell, there can be no heaven. Hey presto, Atehequa, back to normal. Well said, Atehequa, may I pinch it as it is a beauty?

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## mazHur

God, Poet and Justice  :Smile: 

God said, 'Adam, I
Want you to do
Something for Me.'

Adam said, 'Gladly,
Lord, what do You
Want me to do?'

God said, 'Go down
Into that valley.'

Adam said, 'What's a Valley?'

God explained it to
Him. Then God said,
'Cross the river.'

Adam said, 'What's a River?'

God explained that
To him, and then said,
'Go over to the hill....'

Adam said, 'What is a
Hill?'

So, God explained to
Adam what a hill was.

He told Adam, 'On
The other side of the
Hill you will find a
Cave.'

Adam said, 'What's a
Cave?'

After God explained,
He said, 'In the cave
You will find a woman.'

Adam said, 'What's a Woman?'

So God explained
That to him, too.

Then, God said, 'I
Want you to
Reproduce.'

Adam said, 'How do
I do that?'

God first said (under
His breath), 'Geez.....'

And then, just like Everything else, God Explained that to
Adam, as well.

So, Adam goes down
Into the valley,

Across the river, and
Over the hill, into the
Cave, and finds the
Woman.

Then, in about five Minutes, he was back.

God, His patience
Wearing thin, said
Angrily, 'What is it
Now?'

And Adam said....

*
(YOU'RE GOING TO LOVE THIS!!!!!!)

*

*

'What's a headache?'

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## G L Wilson

Deep in the Bible,
a maggot in filth.

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## mazHur

> Deep in the Bible,
> a maggot in filth.


spewing filth...you!
Will lead you nowhere!
_
" One in whose head is conceit 
Think not that he will ever listen to truth."_
(Clarke).

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## G L Wilson

The serpent's is a mind full of lies.

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## mazHur

Beware, I discern a ''narrow thing in the grass''!!

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## G L Wilson

> Beware, I discern a ''narrow thing in the grass''!!


Is it a rake or your brain?

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## mazHur

> Is it a rake or your brain?


When will you grow up, boy,
To be a Man??

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## mazHur

Just for a change.....!!







ATHEIST IN THE WOODS

An atheist was walking through the woods.

'What majestic trees!
'What powerful rivers!
'What beautiful animals!
He said to himself.

Suddenly, he heard a rustling in the bushes behind him.

He turned to look . . . and saw a 7-foot grizzly bear charge towards him.


He ran as fast as he could along the path.
He looked over his shoulder & saw that the bear was closing on him ....

He looked over his shoulder again,
and the bear was even closer ....

and then ..... He tripped and fell.

Rolling over to pick himself up, he found the bear was right on top of him ...... 
reaching towards him with its left paw ... 
and raising the right paw to strike ...


At that instant the Atheist cried out, 
'Oh my God!'

Time Stopped ...
The bear froze ......
The forest was silent ....

A bright light shone upon the man,
and a voice came out of the sky ...

"You deny my existence for all these years,
you teach others I don't exist
and even credit creation to cosmic accident ..... 
Do you expect me to help you out of this predicament?"

"Am I to count you as a believer?"

The atheist looked directly into the light ....
"It would be hypocritical of me to suddenly ask you to treat me as a Christian now ... 
but perhaps you could make the BEAR a Christian?"

... a pause ...
"Very well," said the voice ...


The light went out.
The sounds of the forest resumed ... 

And the bear dropped his right arm .... 
brought both paws together ....
bowed his head & spoke ...





"Lord, bless this food,
which I am about to receive.

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## G L Wilson

> When will you grow up, boy,
> To be a Man??


To be called a boy is the gravest insult in my culture.

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## mazHur

> To be called a boy is the gravest insult in my culture.


In English literature it is not. 
Take it that way, mister!!

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## mazHur

He Fooled Himself

Be sure your sins will find you out.the Bible

The story is told of a young actor who was trying to impress an important movie director. The actor wanted to send an expensive gift, but he didn't have the money, but he had an idea. If he could find a valuable vase which was already broken and get it at a very small cost, then he could mail it to the director. He would think it had gotten broken in the mail and would be impressed anyway.

So this actor went to an exclusive store and found a vase that had been broken into many pieces. It was just going to be thrown out, so he was able to get it at a very small cost. He told them to wrap it up and send it and gave them the address. He waited to hear from the director, but heard nothing for several days. Finally he sent a telegram: "Did vase arrive?" Shortly he received this response: "Vase arrived. But why was each piece wrapped separately?"2

As Abraham Lincoln said, You may fool all the people some of the time, you can even fool some of the people all of the time, but you cannot fool all of the people all of the time.

But with God we can never fool him any of the time. Be sure your sins will find you outmine too!

Suggested prayer: "Dear God, deliver me from the sin of denial and trying to fool myself into justifying whatever wrong I want and choose to dolet alone trying to fool you. Thank you for hearing and answering my prayer. Gratefully in Jesus name, amen.

1. Numbers 32:23 (KJV).
2. From Alan Smiths Thought for the Day, http://www.tftd-online.com.
by Richard (Dick) Innes
< :Smile: )))><

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## G L Wilson

> In English literature it is not. 
> Take it that way, mister!!


Has sodomy always been big where you are?

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## mazHur

> Has sodomy always been big where you are?


Sodomy is universal...prehistoric. 
Even wine is prohibited here by law, not to talk of ''higher fun', sodomy!

IF sodomy was fair
eating through the intestinal abyss
would have been allowed.
But God wished it not to be
yet sinners sin and in their whims
try to fool God!
While the God-fearing look at them with awe!
For this reason alone, it seems
God created this Universe!!
Maz

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## G L Wilson

> IF sodomy was fair
> eating through the intestinal abyss
> would have been allowed.
> But God wished it not to be
> yet sinners sin and in their whims
> try to fool God!
> While the God-fearing look at them with awe!
> For this reason alone, it seems
> God created this Universe!!
> Maz


Then God created the Universe for us to commit sin, is this right?

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## mazHur

> Then God created the Universe for us to commit sin, is this right?


Read Canterbury Tales by Chaucer for enlightenment.

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## G L Wilson

> Read Canterbury Tales by Chaucer for enlightenment.


Why don't you just answer the question?

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## mazHur

> Why don't you just answer the question?


Is there something wrong with your cognitive ability?? Can't you read what I wrote??

I said God created everything....but ''sinners sin''....in their whims while ''While the God-fearing look at them with awe!''...
To sin is man's own act not endorsed either by God,Nature or common sense!!

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## G L Wilson

If God is all-powerful, why did he create a sinner?

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## mazHur

> If God is all-powerful, why did he create a sinner?


your govt may be all powerful; your country's laws more powerful, yet crime 
is committed. People wrong only on their own..similarly they sin because of their little 'will''!! But unlike govts or country laws which react quickly and immediately, God's mill grinds slowly but surely!!

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## G L Wilson

> your govt may be all powerful; your country's laws more powerful, yet crime 
> is committed. People wrong only on their own..similarly they sin because of their little 'will''!! But unlike govts or country laws which react quickly and immediately, God's mill grinds slowly but surely!!


Are you a slave to this god?

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## mazHur

> Are you a slave to this god?


Who isn't slave to Laws! Even a lion is a pussy cat in a cage..
God has given 'will' to humans....how can then humans be slaves to Him??
All living things are 'slaves' to air, food,water and sex; non-living things to their ' sensual stillness' and lack of 'motility'. 

God has given humans a road map to live their lives, the same as your government, institutions, family and society gives you one. Try get out of their limits and feel the brunt. Why then believe the Creator, God, for being lesser??? If He's not important to you why is His name always on your lips??

If Moses and Jesus were there..... What would have
been their reaction to this????

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq_Q3...layer_embedded

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## YesNo

> Why then believe the Creator, God, for being lesser??? *If He's not important to you why is His name always on your lips?*?


Good point!

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## mazHur

*Playing God*
Adam Rutherford meets a new creature created by American scientists  the spider-goat. It is part goat, part spider, and its milk can be used to create artificial spiders web.

It is part of a new field of research, synthetic biology, with a radical aim: to break down nature into spare parts so that we can rebuild it however we please.

This technology is already being used to make bio-diesel to power cars. Other researchers are looking at how we might, one day, control human emotions by sending biological machines into our brains.

Watch the full documentary now


http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/playi...ries+Online%29

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## G L Wilson

What is God's point in creating an atheist?

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## Darcy88

G L WILSON IS BACK! 

Welcome back Willy. If God created us he would have created along with us the possibility for atheism. If I was God I would have added to creation a few fat pinches of chance. I would make free men, not slaves.

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## cafolini

> G L WILSON IS BACK! 
> 
> Welcome back Willy. If God created us he would have created along with us the possibility for atheism. If I was God I would have added to creation a few fat pinches of chance. I would make free men, not slaves.


So you must think it's ultimately determined?

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## Darcy88

> So you must think it's ultimately determined?


I'm a card-carrying determinist, Fate is the only God I recognize, but I'm not quite sure what you mean by this question Caf. I was saying if God created man then God would have created him free and able to err. Creating slaves would make for poor theatre.

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## Mutatis-Mutandis

Welcome back, G L!

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## G L Wilson

The problem of evil has never been answered fully by any one of those to which it is posed the most. The idea that God's only excuse is that he does not exist is met by a deep uncomprehending silence as if a twist in the tale is not permitted. "Everything's permitted."  The only thing that stops us from anarchy is an obedience to human law and nothing else as is clearly shown by example.

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## Darcy88

> The problem of evil has never been answered fully by any one of those to which it is posed the most. The idea that God's only excuse is that he does not exist is met by a deep uncomprehending silence as if a twist in the tale is not permitted. "Everything's permitted." The only thing that stops us from anarchy is an obedience to human law and nothing else as is clearly shown by example.


The ancient Greeks had a code of honour and decency and look at _their_ gods. I understand the significance of the so called "death of God," but really, there was more than just God keeping us at least moderately in line for those two Christian millenniums. Look at the Chinese, they didn't have our God. 

"Everything is permitted" only if we permit it, and its simple as that. Only a madman, a bull goose loon, would extend philosophical nihilism to practical nihilism. Is there really nothing good in this world? Of course there is. Even if at times we can't appreciate it we know its there. There's always love and beauty if nothing else. Imagine a world bereft of those two things and this world becomes by contrast "good."

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## mazHur

Evil is who Evil does
Why blame God??

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## Buh4Bee

God isn't will work with you, if you'll work with him. If you want to follow the rules then God will play.

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## G L Wilson

> Evil is who Evil does
> Why blame God??


Because it is supposed that God is omnipotent. As Stendhal said, "God's only excuse is that he does not exist."

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## G L Wilson

> God isn't will work with you, if you'll work with him. If you want to follow the rules then God will play.


Explain that to the Jews.

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## Paulclem

:Biggrin:  You're back! 

It's been a while GL.

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## DarkAntigone

The problem, people has taken God literally but there is actually more to it. Early human beings have been enlightened with their thinking and realizations that they can actually create beautiful ideas such as creating gods and goddesses and other allegories or symbols. They were enlightened so much that they appreciate every atom in the world

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## Theunderground

Ah,the enlightened savage myth.

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