# Reading > General Literature >  Modern Tragic heroes?

## dandelion

Hi, I have an assignment in a lit class to compare Creon from Antigone to a modern day tragic hero. Basically someone nowadays who's fallen from a high position because of a personal flaw. I would greatly appreciate it if anyone could help me out with ideas...

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## togre

How about Dr. House?

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## dandelion

Thanks for the idea! Sorry I forgot to clarify in my OP, but the person needs to be a real-life person, as opposed to someone from literature, etc. But otherwise I really like that.

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## Seasider

Gordon Brown? The Duke of Windsor? Howard Hughes?

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## PoeticPassions

(former) IMF chief, Dominique Strauss-Khan

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## PoeticPassions

Bernie Madoff... 

Even Barack Obama in some sense (was seen as a savior and idealized, only to have disappointed the masses-- and he has had one of the worst drops in approval ratings in history)

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## togre

Sports stars are also a decent option. You could go OJ Simpson or Mark McGwire or Manny Ramierz or Mike Tyson. And that's just US sports. I know nothing about futboll, but I'm sure soccer has it's own cast of tragic heroes.

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## Seasider

George Best...brought down, as so many others were, by drink.

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## Emil Miller

> (former) IMF chief, Dominique Strauss-Khan


Dominique Strauss-Kahn could be called a number of things but I don't think tragic hero is among them.

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## dandelion

Thanks everyone I really appreciate your answers! I really like Howard Hughes and OJ Simpson, someone in the class is already doing Madoff which I think is perfect, so though I'd like to do him I can't. But though I'm not pointing out each suggestion they're all really good and are good springboards for more ideas. Thanks again!!

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## PoeticPassions

> Dominique Strauss-Kahn could be called a number of things but I don't think tragic hero is among them.


Yeah ok, touche....

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## LitNetIsGreat

Jesus, look at the state of Gazza these days.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2...-alive-kicking

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## Buh4Bee

Bill Clinton- got impeached for his extra curricular martial affair with Monica Lewinsky.

I second Bernie Madoff.

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## JBI

> Bill Clinton- got impeached for his extra curricular martial affair with Monica Lewinsky.
> 
> I second Bernie Madoff.


Meh, he also didn't inhale, though he was never impeached.

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## prendrelemick

Gadaffi

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## Austin Butler

It's important to remember WHY Creon is a tragic hero when you are comparing/contrasting him to someone. Creon represents the state against the individualism of Antigone. Also, you need to define WHAT a tragic hero is. No one is going to write this paper for you, but we'd be glad to give you suggestions. I'd go against Bernie Madoff because there is nothing "tragic" about him. Creon suffers because he is trying to uphold the law, do what he thinks is best for the people and his state. But his good intentions turn against him, and he suffers. 

When finding someone to compare to Creon, try and think of a figure who suffers for doing what they think the right thing is.

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## Buh4Bee

Very true! Madoff is not a tragic hero in this case. 

Clinton was impeached, but was acquitted by the senate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeach...f_Bill_Clinton

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## Austin Butler

Thinking this question over, George H.W. Bush is arguably a great "tragic hero." Wether you agree with his politics or not, I think he thought what he was doing was "good" for the United States (a modern crusade of sorts, deregulation, etc.)

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## dandelion

Austin Butler - thanks. I wasn't expecting anyone to write the paper for me, just needed ideas to jump-start who I could do it on  :Smile: 
What I learned the "classic definition" of a tragic hero is, is that it's someone of high standing who falls because of some character flaw... vs. just being someone who was good and then brought tragedy upon themselves. But I see your point. I'm hoping I'll be able to pull off a good, strong comparison. 
I like both Clinton and George H.W. Bush. I'll look into them. Thanks.

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## virginiawang

> someone who was good and then brought tragedy upon themselves.


I believe people who are good will never get into a tragedy. Only those who think about tragedies all day long for people they are not at all connected with, may get into a tragedy, because they are too much obssesed with tragedies, more than people can ever know.

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## cafolini

> I believe people who are good will never get into a tragedy. Only those who think about tragedies all day long for people they are not at all connected with, may get into a tragedy, because they are too much obssesed with tragedies, more than people can ever know.


A little twisted language but I think I know what you mean.
Tragedy in the first place has the element of fatality associated with it. No one can bring tragedy upon themselves. Originally it was a political menace decreed by oracles and probably executed by governments in a most convincing manner. Thus was the idea of predestination established and demonstrated in ancient Greece.
However, a lot of the tragedies of the Greeks were legends that never occurred more than in a figurative sense. They were produced to makebelieve the power of aristocracies and priests (ministers of the gods) to predict the future and intimidate the masses with it.

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## virginiawang

> A little twisted language but I think I know what you mean.


It is not polite to comment on my writing as being "twisted." You do not have to read it if you are having difficulty reading it.

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## OrphanPip

Tragedy doesn't require an element of fatalism, although that is an important element of the most famous classic tragedy, Oedipus Rex. Since the play in question seems to be Antigone, fate is not really part of that play. As the main struggle is Antigone's loyalty to the family being in conflict with the laws of the state, as she sacrifices her life to honour the death of her disgraced brother. 

Arthur Miller argues in Tragedy and the Common Man that the tragic mode works because it is ultimately about the human spirit of resistance. Tragedy ultimately operates off of a sort of moral indignation at the ability of social forces, or fate in some of the classical modes, to overcome the human spirit. However, as Miller argues, they are optimistic because they celebrate the human resistance to these insurmountable forces.

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## cafolini

> Tragedy doesn't require an element of fatalism, although that is an important element of the most famous classic tragedy, Oedipus Rex. Since the play in question seems to be Antigone, fate is not really part of that play. As the main struggle is Antigone's loyalty to the family being in conflict with the laws of the state, as she sacrifices her life to honour the death of her disgraced brother. 
> 
> Arthur Miller argues in Tragedy and the Common Man that the tragic mode works because it is ultimately about the human spirit of resistance. Tragedy ultimately operates off of a sort of moral indignation at the ability of social forces, or fate in some of the classical modes, to overcome the human spirit. However, as Miller argues, they are optimistic because they celebrate the human resistance to these insurmountable forces.


There is always fate and fatality involved in tragedy, even if not in the classical Greek sense. Of course there is always resistence to tragedy, just like there is resistence to a multitude of other things. Same for optimism which is a possible way of dealing with even thinking that McDonald's is open on Christmas eve. But the point of tragedy is the manifestation of fatality unavoidable.

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## Seasider

And the hero in question must be a Hero...like Othello...not just a celebrity like Michael Jackson or Bernie Madoff among many others quoted here.

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## kelby_lake

Tragedy often has social messages in it. It explores the idea of how far we are in charge of our own destinies- whether we are ruled by the gods, our flaws, or whether we have the power to make our own decisions- and looks at moral dilemmas.

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